NAT Enabled Routers

[Denise]

Hi,

I have a couple questions regarding a response in another thread, but didn't want to take that thread down a completely different road. Hope that's oaky.

... have a good Firewall, good AV, both properly configured and always up-to-date, coupled with a NAT enabled router. They do not use p2p 'shiteware', are always careful what they dl and what attachments they open, regularly use anti-spyware, adware, malware, scumware programs ...

I do have AV, Firewall and run AdAware & Spybot obsessively.

Is a NAT required if you’re a home PC user not on a LAN?

If a person did use a P2P should a NAT be used?

What is dl?

Thanks - Denise

[Jazz]

Hey.....quoting me now!! LOL

Is a NAT "ROUTER" required if you’re a home PC user not on a LAN?

Yes, IMO...

If a person did use a P2P should a NAT be used?

Don't use p2p2!!! Simple as that!!!

Kazaa Delivers More Than Tunes

The Dangers of P2P File Sharing

NB dl means download.

[shadow13]

From what I have been reading lately. Nothing is going to keep us safe, no matter what.

The Shadow Knows

[Jazz]

The Shadow knows jack, IMO.....That's what I say....Where did you come from?? Annoyances?? With a different ID, maybe??

[Jazz]

*LMAO***** Just about.....What a waste of space man....*LMAO***

[Denise]

Yes I did quote you Jazz. Sorry, I wasn’t questioning your advise, just didn’t know if it was, for lack of a better word, “appropriate” to quote something from another thread. Hey I’m giddy just figuring out how to use that quote thingy w/o having to ask.

Any recommendations on a NAT? Otherwise, I could go to comp store, they’d see Visa stamped on forehead and send me home with $1000 worth of stuff and I’d be none the wiser.

P2P: I forwarded this to my neighboe and told them it was a bad, bad thing. Now they want to know, removing via the Add/Remove Programs will do the trick to make them more secure?

Thank you both Jazz & Triplate.

[Rocket]

Originally posted by Triplate
If you use P2P..nothing will keep you safe..and anybody that argues otherwise is a fool.

norton internet security does....but since you dont use it you`ll never know

[Jazz]

@ Denise

That's all right. LOL

Linksys are a good bet. Here's some light reading for you. A chap by the name of Steve Gibson. A rather clever cookie, to say the least, IMO: -

Hardware Firewalls/NAT Routers

Linksys BEFSR41

P2P: I forwarded this to my neighboe and told them it was a bad, bad thing. Now they want to know, removing via the Add/Remove Programs will do the trick to make them more secure?

Not really, no, although it will help, naturally. When you use P2P you are leaving yourself wide open. Simple as that, IMO. You will get personal opinions from a wide range of people on this forum and many other quality ones, like the comment made by Rocket. Personally, I don't use P2P of any kind. The only way to a clean system is to do a clean install and keep it clean. Just an opinion.

@ Rocket

norton internet security does....but since you dont use it you`ll never know

Yeah, right........ You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. P2P in itself is nothing more and nothing less than a virii propagation magnet that affects millions of users across the globe. If you use P2P, you just carry on. One of these days, you will get stung. Fact, simple as that.....

[Rocket]

Originally posted by Triplate
Norton???..you gotta be kidding me.

Like I said.....you dont use it, so you dont know.
Which is typical response from people that like to bag on things they dont use, or know about.
The concept of a "very good" firewall, and anti-virus illudes you totally.
Norton internet security scans everything your computer does if it is configured properly. Thats why it uses so much system resources. And the fact that it uses so much power is one of the reasons people dont like it.
But thats what good anti-virus and firewall does...
It` called preventative maintainance...stopping it before it gets in.
Fact of the matter, people are going to use p2p....and always will.

Yet again you have comments on things you dont use, and instead of helping firgure out a way to do things, you continue to say "don`t use it"

[Xanex]

I had to laugh at the responses some of them are just cute. Cute as in japanese cute but Im deviating from my point.

On the NAT subject, NAT is just a way to solve the problem of sharing an internet conection with many people on the same IP address, simple as that, it also provides protection against hackers cos of port numbers etc etc but thats another story.

But yes, once a hacker has managed to bypass what you have you are screwed, your job is to make it as hard as possible for them to gain access, the more time and effort they have to use to get into your machine the more chance they will just give up, there is no "fun" in spending 4 hours (example) breaking into some joe nobody's pc just to stare at their porn collection

As for protection via p2p goes, i just laugh at the stupidity of some people. not using p2p, hahah i cant believe the comments of some people, those comments in themselves show lack of knowlage of the internet and pc's, im amased they manged to get their post count so high.

If ur gonna use p2p great , ur perfectly safe as long as you know what you are downloading. If you dont then thats where you get "stung". EG using kazaa or something and search for britanny spears naked or something along those lines, and instead of selecting the media type you just search under everything, and then u get these 23kb files that pose at pictures but are viruses.

Thats y viruses propagate, people blindly clicking on anything they can get their hands on, and not running ANY AV. which in itself is a must along with a firewall , software and hardware.

I think what rocket was referring to with norton is its personal ID blocking feature and program launcher blocker, these features are very usefull, I use it, i Know exactly what it does, i know how to use it

as THIS states

"Forty-five percent of the executable files downloaded through Kazaa"

note exevutable files, not mp3 or pictures, apart from that flaw in jpeg which was fixed not long ago, downloading exe files bat , scr's etc etc is a no no,

from THIS

Hughes used such keywords as "Britney Spears," "Microsoft XP," "nude" and "porn" to choose the files he downloaded on Kazaa, focusing on some of the common files that users might share and the most popular keywords placed in search engines. He looked only at executable files -- program files that launch when a user double-clicks them, and that usually end with .exe extensions in the file name. These are the types of files that most often contain malicious code.

He said a lot of the malicious code he found was embedded in program files that are designed to bypass or break copyright protections placed on software files like Microsoft Office to allow users to share pirated copies of the software.

So far, however, music, picture and movie files have not been infected with malicious code, because they aren't executables, Hughes said. Users can't run them simply by clicking on them. People need to open them through another program, such as a multimedia program like Real Player.

Hughes said an attacker could trick a user into thinking a malicious file is a music or movie file by giving the file name a double extension such as .wav.exe (for music) or .jpg.exe (for images). If users don't know .exe indicates an executable file, they would click on it and launch the malicious program.

Hughes said it is also possible that someone will eventually find a way to infect movie and music files with malicious executable code, although it hasn't been done yet.

Though...

http://www.mainstream.net/security_h..._sharing.shtml

that site was just plain BS , wrote to scare and put people off from using p2p software. yes there can be spyware, which is highly bloated atm, with kazaa etc you are told what is installed on your machine, the bigger problem with spyware are the cookies and the embedded code into sites that does stuff to your machine that you dont know about, at least with kazaa etc you are told whats going on to an extent , i just wont go into that debate atm, yes it does have some good points, but anyone who knows their worth of pc's can easily avoid these things

Not suprised it was endorced by the RIAA

having p2p software on your pc is NOT , i repeat NOT illegal. its what you use the software to do IS. like using a vcr to record a program on tv to watch at a later date is not illegal, using it to copy a video IS.

screw those people who try to scare you into not downloading, if ur not downloading or uploading millions of files then they wont do anything, they cant possible prosocute everyone like that, there is a back log of cases going 3 years back yet to be resolved in the courts for the minor offences of sharing one file.

as far as i know it there a very few ways to force a P2P software to download something you dont want,


So to recap

P2P good, just be carefull

NAT , simple way to share an internet connection with many users

RIAA sucks

Norton/panda/AVG good stuff, a must have

Norton/ZoneAlarm/Sygate etc good to have

AND dont forget, USE YOUR BRAINS, if a file looks suspicious it probably is and you shouldnt download it


--- Xanex

[Rocket]

Not trying to ride your coat tails, Xanex, but I just want to say a few words.
a router:

1. connection sharing for mutiple computers
2. for dsl users to keep an open connection without the use of an access manager program
3. a firewall...(which wont stop what you allow, like p2p)

I couldn`t put it in words the same way as Xanex did.

I`ve downloaded 100, 000`s of files..(literally) with p2p programs. All in a time span of 3 years, on this computer.
And in that time i`ve never had to reformat, or had any serious problems, due to good anti-virus, scanning programs, and common sence...

And once again....people that dont actually use the programs, shouldn`t be giving advice

[Xanex]

I realised in my last crusade to inform the less informed that i neglected to offer my knowelge on the origenal post

Originally posted by Denise
Hi,


I do have AV, Firewall and run AdAware & Spybot obsessively.

Is a NAT "router"(?) required if you’re a home PC user not on a LAN?

If a person did use a P2P should a NAT "router"(?) be used?

1stly, Having an AV softeware firewall, good stuff, running anti spyware stuff , great good work

2ndly NO a NAT router is NOT required, its good to have, being you dont have to have ur pc constantly switched on to maintain the connection. but a simple BB modem connected is fine. the casual user on BB is at the SAME risk of being hacked as a casual user of dial up, and you dont see them using a NAT router (normally), most BB services have the same rotating random ip asigning as dial up.

NAT is required if you wish to have more than one person on ur LAN, its kinda a done thing, you wont be able to do it otherwise if you didnt have a nat router, most if not all modem/routers "gateways" will have it,

I use a NAT router/modem on my network and im the only person on it, just because i refuse to run the shit dial in software that the ISP's dish out, rebranding my OS stuff to their company

3rdly NO you dont have to use a nat router to use p2p in the sense that any programmer that can code a virus can code in counter measures like uPNP that most routers seem to have

once a virus is on ur machine even with a hardware nat firewall router, it can still propogate, port numbers like 80 etc are fully open to the router since every machine uses them and the router is quiet happy about it, couldnt care less.

what will stop it is a good av and software firewall. since the hardware solution to the software problem is insanly expensive, only used by corporate companys

infact most p2p programs will work without configuring the router at all...

The benefits of a software firewall are numberless, eg #1 ( ok i realise this has a number, yes you got me on that one, but if you tried to write them all down you wouldnt be able to, but i digress )you have a program on your machine that constantly checks for updates OR takes ages to initialise because it wont operate without first checking the net connection, and if its server is being slow it can just take hours, block the access with the firewall and just stop its access, the fewer programs that you have connecting to the net the safer your machine is


NB IF you have a WIRELESS router/modem thing then PLEASE configure it properly. I have personally sat on top of a hill with my laptop and a modifed pringles tube and surfed the net freely throughout my town, its lit up like a christmas tree with all the open wireless networks


NP Rocket my coat is fine ty LOL

[Jazz]

Rocket and Xanex, if you check any of my posts, what I endorse is a good Firewall plus a good AV, coupled with a NAT router, all properly configured and up-to-date at all times = the best security you are likely to get, end of! I am not aware of ever stating that a NAT router is going to be of any benefit using P2P, In fact, my response to the initial poster on the subject of using a NAT router whilst using P2P was merely, ‘Don't use p2p2!!! Simple as that!!!‘

I agree that many folk are going to use P2P, as it is inherent to human nature. The ‘as long as it’s free’ mentality…..Each to their own. As I said to Rocket, ‘If you use P2P, you just carry on. One of these days, you will get stung. Fact, simple as that’ That’s my opinion and I will not deviate from it. The same applies to you Xanex.

Furthermore, regardless of whether you are networked or not, a NAT router is a must, IMO, especially if you use broadband. Everybody is entitled to an opinion, especially regarding one as emotive as security.

We all agree on the principle of using a good Firewall and good AV, properly configured and always up-to-date. Therefore, I will leave that subject to rest. All I have stated in addition, is that I endorse a NAT router in conjunction with these. Nothing more and nothing less.

BTW Rocket, ‘preventative maintenance’ is not using P2P in the first place, IMO.

In response to the ‘post count’ snide remark Xanex, I think that I have mentioned P2P, aside from this thread, approximately 10 times out of that total and that’s being conservative.

As for protection via p2p goes, i just laugh at the stupidity of some people. not using p2p, hahah i cant believe the comments of some people, those comments in themselves show lack of knowlage of the internet and pc's,………..

I’ve read some strange philosophy on numerous boards in my time, however, that must be one of the most irresponsible remarks that I have ever come across. Engage brain before operating mouth, or in this case, key strokes, springs to mind. You should have known better than to make a comment like that Xanex.

BTW, who said anything regarding the legality of having P2P software on your system? The article merely stated, verbatim, ‘sharing by creating multiple copies of a copyrighted work is illegal’.

Still, each to his/her own. If an individual uses, or wants to use P2P, more the fool them, IMO.

[Xanex]

Jazz, dude , if the cap fits wear it man.

I did specify that P2P is LEGAL, its what you do with it that makes it ILLEGAL , big difference, im not condoning it in any way shape or form

Triplate.

If ur the only person on ur lan you can use the DMZ function, this by default disables the NAT function. in my haste i neglected to specify totally, NAT is requierd if u wish to run a lan and connect to the internet, but then since it was the subject of p2p and the internet i didnt think i had to dumb it down for people that much

Both of you, My response might have been from the gut but i didnt like the way you 2 where treating another member of the forum

The Forum is about helping people, not to lecture them on ones personal views. People are doign things they probably shouldn't each and every day. Giving three and four word answers rather than explaining helps no one. Making polite suggestions along with having a way to back up your claim is always best in my opinion, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, putting another person down because they dont share the same as you is wrong, that is what prompted my respose

Peace

[Rocket]

JAZZ

Everything you`ve said has been correct .
And I dont dispute anything you`ve said, even the advice of not using p2p.
Using p2p programs, is not any worse than just connecting to the internet....you can get viruses and or attacked, just by connecting to the internet, and not even doing a thing!

Fact of the matter is...everyone wants to get the most out of their computers. Whats the point of having it if you dont do anything with it, besides read e-mail, and read/post threads in forums?
The only way you`ll ever be 100% safe, is to shut your PC off, put it in a closet and never use it again.

BTW: I have no problems with you or your advice, as long as you acknowledge that it is just your opinion, (which you have in this case) unless you have hard proof to back it up.

TRIM PLATE on the other hand, hasn`t posted one useful bit of information in this thread, or in so many others......and in my opinion gives bad advice, if any at all.

NO one needs belittling comments from a guy like that.